How early can you season your thanksgiving turkey?

Thanksgiving question (origin of word "turkey")

• Hello Researchers, Turkeys (the fowls) are named, in English, after the country of Turkey. In Hebrew, however, we call them "hodu", which is the Hebrew name for the country of India. In French they are called "dinde" which is a distortion of "d'inde", meaning "from India". I have long been fascinated by this geographical/linguistic phenomenon, and I would like to know the origin of the English term and the Hebrew/French term. Also, I think the bird itself originates in America, far away from either India or Turkey. Perhaps this is related to Columbus's mistaking of America to the Indies? One more amazing and related observation, which I can only guess is entirely coincidental, is the following: The word "hodu" (=Hebrew name of turkeys, country of India) is related to the word "hodaya" meaning "the giving of thanks" (the Hebrew name for the holiday of thanksgiving is "chag ha-hodaya".) Is this related to the American tradition of eating turkeys on thanksgiving? This does not appear in the "official" story of thanksgiving. To answer my question, you must cite an authoritative source explaining the origin of the English and French/Hebrew terms for turkey. I will give a tip if you can dig up some reference explaining the thanksgiving/hodu connection (or lack thereof). One more thing I would appreciate seeing comments about (not part of the "paid" question): Are there any other languages in which turkeys are named after a country (Turkey/India/some other country)? Cheers, dannidin

• Answer:

  Hello Dannidin and thank you for your fascinating question. According to the Merriam Webster dictionary: turkey: from confusion with the guinea fowl, supposed to be imported from Turkish territory Date: 1555 Merriam Webster Dictionary http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary From the Ayto Dictionary of Word Origins: “The term turkey was originally applied to the "Guinea-fowl", apparently because the bird was imported through Turkish territory. When the American bird we now know as the turkey was introduced to the British in the mid 16th century it reminded them of the “Guinea fowl" from Turkey and they called the bird a Turkey bird.” Source: Ayto Dictionary of Word Origins, 1983. The University of New Mexico, Albuquerque http://www.unm.edu/~dave/words/turkey.html According to Klein's _Etymological Dictionary of the English Language, “turkey is the name "originally applied to the guinea : fowl, imported from Africa through traders who dealt chiefly with the Near East : (and for this reasons were called 'Turkey-merchants'); hence the birds sold by : these merchants came to be known as turkeys." http://www.andes.missouri.edu/personal/dmartinez/diffusion/msg00367.html Wilton's Word & Phrase Origins discusses the word turkey in the following excerpt: “The bird we today call a turkey is native to America. Yet, how did it become associated with the country of Turkey? The answer is that the American wildfowl is not the only bird called a turkey. That, since 1552, is also a name for the guinea-fowl. That bird, native to Africa, was brought to Europe via Turkey. When Europeans arrived in America, they noticed similarities between the guinea-fowl and the American bird and called the latter turkey. So, the name is from the country although the bird is in no way associated with it.” Word Origins Website http://www.wordorigins.org/wordort.htm The word for turkey is also credited to Luis de Torres, the interpreter on Columbus’s expedition: “Luis de Torres, a Jew baptized shortly before Columbus' fleet sailed, was the interpreter of the expedition. (..) He discovered “a large wild bird with a head and body very similar to the peacock. The male even had a feather display which, while not as spectacular, resembled the peacocks. De Torres, with his background of Biblical Hebrew but poor ornithological knowledge, called this bird a tukki, which over the centuries has been corrupted into our "turkey." Jewish World Review Website http://www.jewishworldreview.com/1199/TALKIN'1.ASP French “It is interesting that in French, according to the Larousse Etymologique, dinde f, dindon m (turkey) originally was applied to the guinea-fowl (pintade),: and derives from coq/poule de l'Inde. Later this was extended to the: American turkey.” http://www.andes.missouri.edu/personal/dmartinez/diffusion/msg00367.html “In French, turkey is called dinde, from India, because French explorers thought that they had reached the east.” http://www.cha-shc.ca/bilingue/addresses/1995.htm Hebrew The student Rabbi Jack Romberg discusses the relation of the Hebrew word hodu to the word todah which means thanks. “The idea of giving thanks for the abundance of the harvest is what we do at Sukkot. The idea that we should feel blessed with the bounty that is provided for us at a meal is central to the Motzi and the birkat hamazon, the blessings before and after the meal. (..) On Sukkot, indeed all of our festivals, we recite Hallel. Hallel is a set of Psalms of praise to God which we say as a "thank you" for the particular celebration. A key phrase that occurs in Hallel is this: "Hodu l'adonai, ki tov" which translated means, "Giving thanks to God is good." The Hebrew word "hodu" means "giving thanks" and is related to the Hebrew word "todah," which means "thank you." However, "hodu" is also the Hebrew word for "turkey." So we can translate the same phrase (Hodu l'adonai ki tov) this way: "Eating turkey for the sake of God is good!" The word "hodu" from our festival psalm of praise means both "giving thanks" and "turkey!" Finally, the English word, "turkey" may have its origins in the Hebrew word "tookie" which is the word for another large feathered bird, the parrot.” Source: The Union of American Hebrew Congregations http://www.uahc.org/congs/va/va001/Beth%20Sholom%20Temple%20New/Pulpit/Past%20Sermons/1199y.htm In the article “Is Turkey Kosher?” by Rabbi Ari Z. Zivotofsky, Ph.D. the origin of turkey is also discussed. “A major problem in analyzing the responsa is the confusion surrounding the turkey's name, which relates to the confusion of where Columbus had landed and where this new bird came from. About 1530 when this new dish started appearing on English tables, it had been brought to England by merchants trading in the eastern Mediterranean. These merchants were called "Turkey merchants" because the whole area was then part of the Turkish Empire and the bird was called "Turkey bird" or "Turkey cock". (..)The English are among the few who related this bird to Turkey. Nearly everyone else thought it came from India, whereas in reality it came from Mexico, which was then known as The Spanish Indies or the New Indies. Thus, in most European languages, Arabic, and Hebrew it is called something like the "bird of India". Even in Turkey they call it hindi, as though it came from hindistan, which is Turkish for India. The modern Hebrew (tarnagol hodu) and Yiddish (hendika hen) names both mean "Indian chicken". Source: Kashrut.com Website http://www.kashrut.com/articles/turk_part5/ The connection of Thanksgiving to the Jewish tradition is to the holiday of Succoth. According Dr. Michael Feldberg, Ph.D. - American Jewish Historical Society in his article Thanksgiving and the Jews: Pennsylvania, 1868. “The first "American" Thanksgiving was held in Plymouth, Massachusetts in 1621, attended by 90 Native Americans and 50 English Pilgrim settlers. That first Thanksgiving mirrored ancient harvest feasts such as the Jewish Succoth, the ancient Greek mid-June Thesmophorian celebration and the ancient Roman Cerealian rites of mid-April.” Jewish Community Federation http://www.sfjcf.org/jholidays/holidayinfo/story.asp?ArticleID=23637 Additional information that may interest you: The word turkey is related to India for the following languages: Arabic (standard) - turkey is diiq hindi, or Indian rooster. Azari - 'hindishga', that's something related to 'Hind'(India). Basque - "indioilar" or "indioilo" Catalan - “dindi". Hebrew - "tarnegol hodu" or “Indian rooster" Polish - indyk, or more specifically indor 'male turkey', indyczka 'female turkey' from the name 'India'. Russian - indjuk_(male), indjushka/indejka (female). As food, the turkey is referred to by the term indjushka. In sum, it's the "bird of India," as in French. Turkish - 'hindi'. Yidish - "indik". In Danish, Dutch, Finnish and Norwegian, it is associated with a town from the Malabar coast (southern India): Source: Eastern Michigan University http://www.emich.edu/~linguist/issues/7/7-174.html Thomas F. Shannon lists the word turkey in different languages here: http://www.emich.edu/~linguist/issues/7/7-174.html An article by A. Engler Anderson which discusses Jewish themes in the American Thanksgiving holiday. http://web.archive.org/web/20010108135300/http://lynx.neu.edu/a/aengler/clips/turkey.htm Thanksgiving: A Jewish Holiday? http://www.mazornet.com/jewishcl/thanksgiving01.htm How Turkey Got Its Name http://www.hunot.com/holidays/thanksgiving/thanksgiving.htm#trivia Search Criteria: origin of the word turkey Thanksgiving has "Jewish" roots "tarnegol hodu" hebrew "day of turkey" +thanksgiving etymology Hebrew turkey hebrew turkey hodu turkey French origins I hope you find this helpful. Best Regards, Bobbie7-ga