How to approach the same old argument in a new way

A relationship skill that you seem to be missing is letting him be good enough. This is a really hard skill that even people with lots of past relationships fail, so don't beat yourself up over it. Here's what I mean: when he stays because you ask him, that needs to be good enough. He's not a mind reader that knows what you need without you telling him. I totally understand why it feels tainted to have to ask for what you need, but you have to find a way to let that go. It's a hard skill, but it's absolutely necessary. So, find some time now that you're both calm and talk in concrete terms about what you both wish would have happened. Play act the scenario at a remove. Do Not Argue. Do Not Blame. Do Not Talk Through What Went Wrong. This is important. The whole point is to lay down a new path to follow next time. It does not matter what has gone wrong in the past, stop rehashing it. Both of you swear to pretend it has never happened and you're talking about a totally made up thing that you want to get right if it ever comes up. If you start to slip up and talk about the past, take a three minute breather, put aside hurt feelings and keep going. Figure out two things he could do to help you feel comforted and heard when you're having a BIG EMOTION. Ask if they sound doable, and work out the specifics of how that might go down. For his part, he should think of what he needs from you. Would it be enough for you to say a one word description? For your described situation, I would say Overwhelmed. Is that enough for him to stick by your side until you calm down to say more? Does he need you to do some aftercare for him? Etc. Be prepared for this to not go down perfectly this first time. The first time you have Big Emotions after your talk, take some time to debrief after the storm has cleared. During the debrief, ONLY PRAISE. Say "it really helped me calm down when you took my hand and asked if it was time for ice cream. Thank you." You can say one thing, gently, you wish you had done better. Say "it took me a minute to understand that you were trying to help. Next time, I'll know you're on my team faster." But you can't beat yourself up and stir up the emotions again. You're just communicating that you see you have an area of improvement, and you're on it. If you want him to do the debrief too, you need to agree to that when you're talking through how this would go in an ideal world. Don't just expect him to follow in your example. Be explicit. When you talk through how you want this to go in an ideal world, don't turn yourselves into ideal versions. Assume that you're exactly as you are now, just with some extra knowledge. So, no magical thinking. If he knows he locks up, the answer can't be "I won't lock up." It has to be something that will get him past it. "When I lock up, please tell me that you need a hug to unfreeze me" would be acceptable. It honors who he is, gives a path forward, and is constructive. You probably need to have a few more conversations as you try things out. If you initially thought being offered ice cream would help, but it just makes you mad? Well, regroup. Own that it didn't work and talk about what you should try next time. For your part, you need to let things work. If there's part of you that wants to calm down and part of you that wants to keep having Big Emotions, you need to let the calm part win. It's a skill that takes practice and you'll get better at it if you keep at it.

If I'm upset with *him*, the conversation becomes an explanation of why I shouldn’t be upset. This is bad news bears. He does not get to decide that you shouldn't be upset about something. He needs to stop, listen, and hear you to understand why you're upset, empathize with you, and look for a solution. This is the core issue here -- everything else you're experiencing is symptomatic. If he thinks that your feelings are invalid and spends time trying to shut you down, he is not being a good partner and maybe that's why he got divorced in the first place.

I think when you have expectations on how he should act, you will always be disappointed. If he did comfort you in a way that was perfect for you, it wouldn't fix your depression or anxiety about your job. It might give you some temporary comfort, but it's not lasting. In a relationship, when you do something that bugs your partner and your partner tells you about it, you make an effort to curb that behavior. If you can't or won't, the partner will have to take it or leave. He does some things that bug you, you do things that bug him. Perhaps try changing the way you express emotion, which sounds so judgmental on my part, but if it's overwhelming for him, you might want to cry in the shower. It sounds like in your situation you may have a lack of coping. We all have to cope. It sounds like maybe you are waiting for him to hear you and come to your rescue. He can't rescue you. Life has its difficulties, and there are dead-end jobs, but we have to cope and self-soothe. Every human has to deal with loneliness, feelings of being unheard, and disappointment in even the most loving relationships. Partners aren't mind-readers and they aren't our therapists or our parents. Relationships are a bonus. They are icing on the cake. We love ourselves first, we stand on our own two feet, and know that no partner can fix us or heal our wounds. This is me talking on my soap-box. I'm not always good about taking my own advice, but I find it to be true.

Please keep in mind that your boyfriend cannot make you feel better. Up to a point you can give him directions what to do - not leave, hold you, pay attention, but he does not have a magic wand where if he does what you want without prompting, he will make you feel good again. The bad feelings are inside you. His input may help you feel a little better, but then again they may not and if they don't make you feel better it is a horrible mis-direction to change your focus from "I feel bad" to "You are supposed to make me feel better and you won't". It is important for your own mental health and for your relationship that you do not make him responsible for your feelings. If you he had not come home when you were crying in the bathroom how would you have moved past the anxiety and gotten to where you feel better? Next time you are crying or upset, can you be tough, throw some reassurance at the boyfriend and not ask him for help, sympathy or company? This is not about him and what he does. It's about you and your emotional reactions. It is a terrible wrong direction if you keep trying to figure out how to get him to make you feel better. You have already tried changing how he behaves by asking him to stay, and it hasn't worked to make you feel better. This means that you have to change what you do in order to feel better and not to change what he does.

I really feel for your situation, adastra because I have been you where you are and it hurts and confuses like hell and plays into all kinds of communication and self-worth unpleasantness. My comments below are as much a letter to my younger self as a reply to you. Do you have any specific suggestions for ways to approach a familiar conversation Have a think of about it this way. Phase 1. You have big emotions that you need to express. So you are meeting your own need by expressing them. Good. Phase 2. Boyfriend enters frame. Boyfriend loves you, wants the best for you, but he has emotions too and they react to your expression of emotion. Phase 3. Your second need for comfort enters the equation. Phase 4. But Boyfriend's response is to your second need is inadequate. Phase 5. You respond to the inadequacy of his response. Phase 6. Boyfriend changes response to meet your third need of 'adequacy' Phase 7. You feel more heavily because of the dynamics of phases 2-7. Phase 8. Boyfriend is confused at all the changing needs he has to meet. Phase 9. You think 'but if you had just met my Phase 3 need for comfort' all would be good.' And so it goes. You are asking a lot of your boyfriend and the key point is around Phase 2 and Phase 3. You can have big emotions and learn self-soothing techniques. You can have big emotions and say explicitly what you need. "Say nothing, just hug me and let me cry." You can have big emotions and your boyfriend can have emotions too. Your emotional needs don't trump his. You have big emotions, therefore you have a big responsibility to manage them. very overwhelmed by the whole thing, feeling fully disappointed in myself, stuck, and helpless. Basically spiraling out. Have you done any CBT? Your spiralling thinking could be nipped in the bud through some CBT techniques. The AskMe favourite http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0380810336/metafilter-20/ref=nosim/ is an excellent tool, if you do the exercises. Best wishes to you.

He said he didn't want to be there. You asked him to stay and soothe you. Then you told him he didn't stay in the way you wanted. That's a lot of pressure to put on someone else. What you said about his feeling stuck because there is no matter what he does you are disappointed - that is no way to build a relationship. Why is it his job to deal with your emotions when he's clearly said he's not ready to that today? Why aren't his needs worthy? What are the self soothing techniques that you've learned? Just because you think your emotions are bigger, doesn't mean that he doesn't feel things deeply and quietly. Since he grew up in a neglectful/substance abuse family, it's possible he didn't get a lot of training in dealing with emotional outbursts. Couples therapy is something to explore. You both have patterns and expectations which do not align. Please ask someone help you sort this out.

Maybe you need some time to settle yourself and get in tuned with what specifically you are feeling and what you need, and to develop some self-soothing methods before grasping out for help mid-breakdown. It's like how a drowning person is sometimes so crazed with fear that they pull the person helping them down with them. You don't want to do that. When I feel like I'm completely at the verge of falling apart it helps to just stop a moment and think about what I immediately need to be okay (i.e. not weeping or feeling on the precipice of complete catastrophe). This is frequently food, snack, blood sugar, bath, sleep or something similarly basic. Coming together and communicating is a rational process that requires that you have at least the momentary wherewithal to know what you need and be able to communicate that directly and effectively. Post bath/snack/blood sugar boost/deep breathing/mental regrouping is when I am usually most able to say, "I had the most horrible day ever today and it would make me feel 100 degrees better if you held me quietly for 20 minutes while we sat in silence and watched PBS nature documentaries." Or whatever I need to say. It sounds complicated, though. You should talk to a therapist.

These sorts of issues, where what you're really looking for is a way to break a pattern and find a better way to communicate, are precisely the thing that short-term couples counseling with a skilled provider is best at.

Here is something I've learned about emotions: if you are angry, for example, then you don't have to act out that emotion in order to feel heard and validated by someone else. What I mean is: when you're angry with someone, it's very easy to feel like you have to shout and bang around the house in order to make it clear to them exactly how angry you are, and it's easy to feel like that's the only way to get it out of your system. But you can actually tell someone in a calm voice, "I'm feeling really angry right now because of..." and you can work it out with them that way and resolve the angry feeling inside of you without ever raising your voice. And it's a lot easier for someone to engage with you if you're saying calmly, "I'm angry" instead of causing a ruckus. Basically, it's possible to have big emotions but to manage them in such a way (not repress! manage!) that the people closest to you aren't getting hit by the firehose every time. I think that's maybe something you could work on.