How can an attached girl make friends with single guys? Or can she?
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Help a girl make guy friends with a minimum of misunderstandings. (Despite a history of misunderstandings.)I am female, in my late 20s. I am in a committed relationship that is about to temporarily become long-distance. I am about to enter an environment (MBA program) where male students outnumber females three to one. So, I will need (and want) to make friends with my male classmates. However, I've noticed that when interacting with single straight guys, the moment I mention a boyfriend they either lose interest, or act insulted. The former is fine, I guess, if they're only interested in sex/romance we wouldn't work as friends anyway, but the latter is perilous. How can I keep interaction on a friendly level without dropping the "I'm off-limits, buddy" like an anvil, or leading a guy on? This is starting to sound like one of those "I am so beautiful that men prostrate themselves at my feet wherever I go, what shoes should I wear to minimize tripping over them" questions. It's not - I am of average attractiveness, and have deficient social skills, which is why I call on MeFi for help. I suppose I could limit myself to socializing with women and couples, or in large groups only, but just as I studied for the GMAT I want to study this conundrum of human relations and overcome it. Some background: I've been in the relationship since college, and did the long-distance thing in college too. I had single guy friends at the time, and all was well, but this was a close-knit social group so everyone knew of other people's relationships by osmosis. Also, everyone was a geek with limited social skills, which was a stable equilibrium. As a girl with geeky interests (sci-fi, video games), I've always had lots of male friends and was sort of surprised to realize that currently I only socialize with women, couples, and gay guys. Possibly due to the aforementioned losing interest/getting insulted effect. So, why the weirdness and how can I avoid it? In the interest of full disclosure, I do tend to interact with new people in a sarcastic/teasing manner, which I suppose could be interpreted as flirting. I also have ADD, with the attendant ability to hyperfocus, and I tend to hyperfocus upon meeting someone interesting. Meaning that I pay attention to them and ask lots of questions, make a lot of eye contact, and generally am (or try to be) more funny and charming than usual. So that may be perceived as flirtation by guys as well. But I'd hate to just be cold or professional! Is there a middle ground? How can I give the friendly-but-not-looking-for-more signal, when the proof (boyfriend) is thousands of miles away? How can I tell what kind of signal a conversation parter is giving? Especially if he's from one of the more open/flirtatious cultures of, say, southern Europe? I suspect that most females understand this instinctively, but I clearly have a deficiency. I get along just fine with colleagues of both sexes, and can socialize at happy hours and work functions, so I am not worried about networking effectively. I just want to make some good friends in the pressure cooker that is b-school, and not cause any weirdness. Please help me, guys and especially other geeky girls. I am American but will be in an international environment so cross-cultural perspectives are also welcome. Be brutal if necessary.
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Answer:
I'm not sure MBA students are as Facebook-obsessed as my fellow undergrads are at college. But if they are, setting your Facebook relationship status appropriately will solve this problem easily.
Mr Bunnsy at Ask.Metafilter.Com Visit the source
Other answers
Wear pajamas or baggy sweatshirts during your study groups. Don't freshen up. Scrunchies and sneakers. Men notice when you're trying to look nice for them. Absolutely terrible advice.
ThePinkSuperhero
However, I've noticed that when interacting with single straight guys, the moment I mention a boyfriend they either lose interest, or act insulted. Where? This is going to be a different environment than you've known before- most everyone is going to be hyper-focused on school and work and whatever else they've got on their plate. This isn't like turning down Joe Schmoe in a bar. I think you'll have no problems making friends with guys in your class. You don't have to worry about the "signals" anyone but you is giving, because you're not gonna go there. You'll mention your boyfriend casually ("What did you do last night?" "Studied, talked to my boyfriend on the phone, watched American Idol..."), and that'll be that- it's not your job to worry about anyone else's feelings. Don't overthink this one.
ThePinkSuperhero
I've been slowly coming to the realization that most guys, absent a relationship, think of any woman that they interact with or are friends with as a potential girlfriend. All of my best friends are guys. I work much better with men (socializing, etc) than women and I work in a male-dominated field. I never date people I work with, and am in a LTR, but despite that being transparently obvious some of my guy friends have made half-hearted passes at me. More of them, when the subject has come up, have admitted that they are/were attracted to me at some point. I've come to the conclusion that men are opportunistic sexually, for the most part, and eternally hopeful and optimistic. I mostly just try to ignore it and set very firm boundaries physically and in terms of topics I bring up or am open about. Sometimes with limited success, but that's a different story. I don't really think it is a huge deal, and I don't think the friendship has the potential to be any less special, but it is just an aspect of the friendship you just need to accept- they see you as a sexual creature.
arnicae
I know whereof you speak, OP. I've run into this situation fairly frequently -- I have more male friends than female, often find myself in professional situations that have a higher male-to-female ratio, and have been the recipient of some awkward misunderstandings. When I'm not feeling shy, I'm a very friendly gal, and I've definitely been in situations where my natural friendliness and interest in conversation was taken as flirtatious when it was very much not meant that way. As others have mentioned, the ring doesn't necessarily scare people off. Some guys don't seem to have such keen observational powers, and literally don't look for it. Also, conversely, there are those that see it and view it as a challenge. I've had guys try to tell me "oh, pshaw! we could just have an affair!" as I waved my ring in their faces. For serious. However, with most people, slipping mention of my husband into conversation early defuses the situation. And I do try to do it relatively early. First, for the rarer hard cases, the mention makes it clear that my mind is on that relationship, rather than "well, she's wearing a ring, but that doesn't necessarily mean she's not interested in going home with me." Second, and more relevant in most situations, it creates a nice friendly playing field where the guy has a context for my behavior instantly -- rather than interpreting my friendliness as flirting, he's more likely to be able to place it as "she's attached, she's just being friendly." Which saves me some awkwardness later on of having to correct someone's misapprehensions, and him the annoyance of going through a conversation with a very different idea of what is going on. It is key not to be all MY BOYFRIEND LIKES WEATHER. Find a natural spot to insert a single mention, and then drop it -- don't be all, YOU KNOW WHO LIKES BEER? MY BOYFRIEND! and DID I MENTION I'M SEEING MY BOYFRIEND THIS WEEKEND!? And continue as you were, friendly and all. If you don't act weird and guarded, like you're using it as a shield, then they won't see it that way. You're just having a friendly conversation, saying the things you usually would to a friend. If you treat it like that, it won't come off as awkwardly or like a defensive maneuver. I've never had anyone act insulted when I mentioned my boyfriend or husband. Maybe because I do it smoothly enough. :) I have occasionally had people seem to "drop off", like maybe they're not going to invest as much in the conversation, or really, maybe they're just backing off a little now that they know I'm attached. But that's fine. It would be (and is) odd if someone put the hard sell on you after it was clear you weren't looking. Some people do seem to be taking the whole "well gosh, you sure think you're fabulous" tack, which you specifically made points against in your post. To the fellows getting shirty, I do have to say -- it's not that all women think all men are trying to get in our pants, all the time. However, enough of us have usually had what we thought were friendly conversations later reveal themselves to be attempts to get in our pants that we're generally interested in avoiding any possible miscommunications, just for everyone's sake. Even better, many of us have run into accusations of "leading a guy on" in these sorts of situations (that we thought were just friendly chats) by not mentioning a boyfriend/husband early on -- so again, you can see why a lot of us prefer just to be safe. Maye it is a come-on, maybe it's not, and I may not even think you're flirting with me -- but it's clear from my experience that we often have different definitions of what is considered flirtatious, so better just to be on the safe side than trust that my sense that a conversation is not headed that way is correct.
tigerbelly
Be yourself, flirty/hyperfocusing and all, but don't put any extra effort into being attractive when around these guys. Exercise the same amount of energy for your appearance and behavior as you would if you were going to see your brother or cousin. Wear pajamas or baggy sweatshirts during your study groups. Don't freshen up. Scrunchies and sneakers. Men notice when you're trying to look nice for them. And they notice when you're not. It'll send a message without you having to state your availability status directly. And if you *really* need to pull out the stops and turn somebody off, just let one rip. Nothing says "I'm just not that into you" to a new potential than an accidental fart that you're not even embarrassed about.
iamkimiam
My contrarian advice: Continue to act just as friendly and flirtatious as you naturally do, and you'll have loads of friends. You have no obligation to disabuse men of their assumptions unless they ask you straight up or make their intentions clear. If you otherwise end up "stringing them along" inadvertently, it's their fault, not yours. I'm only partly kidding, but seriously -- it's not like men have a constitutional right to have you as a girlfriend just because you don't wear a sign on your head...
mikeand1
I totally don't get why toning down your image is "absolutely terrible advice". Please explain (I'm not being snarky, I'm totally serious. I'm obviously missing something.) There's lots of reasons- #1, it won't work. If you are a funny, smart, flirty person, you could wear a paper sack and still have others find you attractive. #2, you are going to business school to make something of yourself, and to network with people who are looking to be movers and shakers- this is not a time in your life when you want to look like a slob. #3, you are not 12 years old; coming to class just out of bed or wearing sweatpants in a school environment is an ABSOLUTE NO-NO. #4, and this is the most important- changing your costume is the lazy way out. If you want to change how people treat you in a serious way, you need to change the way you think and the way you act. Hiding behind clothes and rings and Facebook profiles while failing to address the inside stuff is.... a waste of life potential, IMO.
ThePinkSuperhero
Jezztek If I'm just being a nice person and someone responds with a comment who's subtext is clearly "I know you want me, but you can forget it buddy" then I might just act insulted because either this implies to me that either A.) you are so vain as to assume it's only natural every man who talks to you must want you, B.) All men only want one thing to begin with, so any attempt to talk with you must mean he is in pursuit of you. Neither of which leaves me inclined to talk to you further. Don't take it personally, Jezztek; a lot of guys take an awful long time to get around to actually asking a woman out, and the lengthy conversation that precedes it is hard to distinguish from just being friendly. Also, your being not inclined to talk to her further makes it look exactly like "MY BOYFRIEND LIKES WEATHER" was appropriate and it worked. For the OP, nthing the "just be yourself" advice, and seconding nerdcore. If he asks you out, just say "I have a boyfriend, but we can hang out as friends. How about lunch?" The prospect of you having a committed SO is something that any guy who asks you out has considered, and should have prepared himself for. Just refuse nicely, counter-offer if you actually want to be friends with the guy, and don't worry about how he ought to take it, because that is his business. Simply not making him feel like a worthless jerk is enough. :)
aeschenkarnos
No joke: wear a ring. Men will still be friendly, but no one will hit on you. (Wear it on your right hand; you're not married but you're "engaged".) Bzzzzzt. Wearing a ring certainly does no harm, and will deter all the respectful and observant guys (though not everyone will think to look at your finger, and not all cultures use rings in the same way), but is not the panacea that some have suggested. As others have said, rings (on men and women both) seem to attract more suitors than they repel. For every person who "respects" the ring, there will be two or three who see it as a signal of potential disease-free, non-stalker sex on the side. (And there are plenty of people wearing rings who are looking for a good, casual time, so that approach is not unwarranted.) Guys don't have "girl friends", they have girls that they hang out with, that they want to have sex with, but are too afraid to lose the time they are spending with a girl they are SEXUALLY attracted to if they are rejected. The whole reason guys hang out with girls is because they are hoping that some day it turns to their favor. Bzzzzzt again. I'm sure at business school you will also have classmates who will be happy to explain everything about gender in terms of pseudo-evolutionary psychology, so you can continue this part of the conversation at your convenience. How can I keep interaction on a friendly level without dropping the "I'm off-limits, buddy" like an anvil, or leading a guy on? There is nothing wrong or insulting or weird about bringing up your boyfriend early and often in conversations. It is the commonly-understood social signal of "I am attached," and works better than a ring in a lot of contexts. It is only awkward if you wait until after you have spent several weeks flirting to drop the "I have a boy/girlfriend" bombshell. The more naturally you can fit it into a conversation, the better, but err on the side of early and often. From time to time when I'm being nice and friendly to a gal she'll "casually" work into a conversation she has a boyfriend, often times it is done so clumsily that it is clear the entire purpose of mentioning the boyfriend is to dissuade any romantic advances. Which would be fine if I was actually making romantic advances (or hell if I was even romantically interested in that person), but since that's not the case it certainly comes off as insulting. That is really weird to me, but probably indicative of how a lot of men see these things, and why these interactions are unpleasant minefields for a lot of women. My reaction is: Why would I be insulted that a woman feels the need to preemptively mention a boyfriend because so many guys hit on her? How is that insulting to me? I can respond with a story about my girlfriend if I have one, or I can ask her about him and learn about something important to her -- something I need to be cool with if we are going to be friends. Being insulted by this is like being insulted that she comes from Michigan or watches baseball -- these are things that are of deep importance to her but say nothing about you. This strikes me as being really immature, honestly. If the OP is getting this kind of reaction from the boys she meets, I suggest she find some men to talk to.
Forktine
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