What is the value offered by an undergraduate computer science degree from a prestigious university?
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Hello, I'm hoping you can help me as I am currently stuck in a pickle. I have been accepted to three universities, all for Computer Science. Each has their own advantages and disadvantages, but I don't know which of my concerns are valid and which ones are not. About me: I have an interest in computer science. I have some experience programming, but I also know that a CS degree will be a more math-focused major. However, I honestly do not foresee myself changing majors at any point in undergrad. Postgraduation, I'm not sure exactly what I am going to do. Right now, I plan on taking a year or two off to do somethings I've always wanted to do. I know I want to work with technology after graduation, but I'm not sure if it will be at the software engineering level, or more in the management/business realm. Right now, I'm tentatively planning on doing a Masters in either CS (through a 5-year combined degree plan), Business, or both, but that's pure speculation. Alright, now on to my choices and the core of my dilemma. UC Berkeley -- Great program, but I'll have to pay the full cost attendance--$55K a year. In addition, my parents are worried about the atmosphere there; they think I'm going to be a "small fish in a big pond" and be overshadowed by other people. UNC Chapel Hill -- Cost of attendance will run at $14K a year. However, I'm worried that the prestige of the program will close a lot of doors to me. Georgia Tech -- Sort of a middle ground between the two schools. Not as prestigious as Berkeley, but not as cheap as Chapel Hill. The Million Dollar Question: Is the the extra $160K I will spend on my undergraduate education worth it for an undergrad Berkeley degree in computer science? What about if I plan to go to grad school? Will I have less opportunities in competing for competitive jobs/internships if I go to Carolina? Thank you so much for your insight. The decision deadline is soon, and I'm absolutely stuck.
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Answer:
Hi there! I almost went to GA Tech before choosing UNC for undergrad, and now I'm in grad school at UC Berkeley; I've done CS the whole way through. So I have some personal experience with your predicament! As Li Pi mentioned, UNC *is* a phenomenal school. I have never felt that any doors were closed to me as a result of having a degree from there; on the contrary, it's given me a lot of opportunities. The all the big tech companies recruit there; I'm pretty sure I got my first internship (at Microsoft) solely because I was in UNC CS. As for grad schools, people choose among the best (I'm at UCB now, a friend a year below me is at MIT, etc). The department is small and close-knit, and it cares deeply about undergraduate education. As a university, the undergraduate experience at Carolina is unbeatable. You're surrounded by down-to-earth yet motivated and ambitious peers who are out to make a positive impact in the world. I've never seen anything like the attachment people develop to UNC at any other university, it's really beyond description. From what I've seen UC Berkeley is also a great place to do your undergrad IF you want to be 100% committed to CS. The undergrads here work extremely hard and the environment feels pretty competitive. That said, the ones who work well in this type of environment do extremely well. A big difference between Cal (and GA Tech) and UNC is that CS at the former is in a college of engineering, whereas at UNC it is in the College of Arts and Sciences. That means that at UNC you'll have more of a breadth of courses in your undergrad degree, whereas at Berkeley you'll pretty much only be doing EE and CS-related courses until you graduate. Personally, I found the non-CS classes I took to be the most rewarding ones; at some level you can teach yourself whatever you don't know in your own field, but it's much harder to start self-learning in an area in which you have no experience. GA Tech I have much less experience with, since I never actually attended it. Cost and location were what made me decide against it. Seems like a good place, but do you really want to live in Atlanta? (I kid, I kid: Atlanta is actually a fun town... but not as good as Chapel Hill or Berkeley!) While this response is maybe a bit biased towards UNC, it is based in first-hand experience (possibly the source of bias). My advice would be to pick the place where you think you'll be happiest and will give you the most flexibility to pursue your interests. That's what I did and everything turned out great. Don't underestimate the impact of cost either -- I was fortunate enough to have scholarships for my undergraduate years, and not having to worry about paying off massive loans immediately after graduation has been more important than I expected. Anyway, as I tell everyone who I'm tasked with recruiting these days, you've got great options, and you really can't go wrong with any of them. Given the caliber of programs you're considering, how your undergraduate years turn out will have a lot more to do with what you bring to the table than with what the school provides. I'd be more than happy to talk to you about this further one-on-one; feel free to contact me through my profile. Best of luck!
Shaddi Hasan at Quora Visit the source
Other answers
I got a CS degree from Georgia Tech, and I have no complaints about the program itself. I really can't answer how much it is worth, but here are some factors you may want to consider: 1. It's harder to maintain a high GPA at Georgia Tech than other schools. (I can't comment on Berkeley and UNC specifically, though.) Throughout my time there, we were told this over and over from faculty and other school resources with a great deal of pride -- "Look how difficult it is here! We're not cushy and our degree is really worth something!" (At GT, dean's list is 3.0. I'm told most schools are much higher.) Along with this we were also repeatedly told that employers knew about GT's exacting standards and took our lower GPA into account when comparing us to non-GT candidates. Unfortunately, I have found this to be totally false. Since I finished at Tech I have lived in Austin, Seattle, and the Bay area -- all tech cities -- and I have come to be friends with people who are interviewers at tech companies. After nearly a decade, I haven't found a single interviewer who knew that Georgia Tech students have lower GPAs. Not one. (Note: It's possible that this has changed since I was there. You could probably look at the dean's list criteria at the three schools as an indicator.) 2. As another commenter said, the Bay area has huge advantages if you want to found or work for a start-up. The environment in the Bay is just not like anywhere else -- everything is about tech. I think this must be how it feels to be an actor and move to New York City or LA -- it's like being in the center of the universe. All the big tech companies give/sponsor free lectures and have opportunities to network and learn things. Salaries and costs are much higher out here, but then you'll have a much higher number to point at if you move somewhere cheaper later on. 3. Georgia Tech seems prestigious in the south, but in other parts of the country I have found it to be much less well known. In the southeast, people used to raise their eyebrows and be impressed when I said I had a CS degree from Tech, but everywhere else I've lived nobody seems to care at all. 4. Unless you're skill-less and inept, I think your parents are wrong to worry about you being a small fish in a big pond for Berkeley. If you are proactive and do things to stand out, you'll stand out at all the schools. If you just keep your head down and finish your degree and don't accomplish anything out of the ordinary, you'll also probably be a small fish if you're at UNC or GT. 5. More and more people -- especially in the Bay are -- are interested in what you can do, not where you came from. I don't know about UNC, but I think at GT you can get a cheap(er) and good education that will be perfectly adequate for getting jobs. But I wouldn't rely on the school -- contribute to open source projects or build an iPhone app or make a website that gets a bunch of visitors. If you can point to something like that, I think it's unlikely to matter where you came from. Everybody I know in tech these days cares about accomplishments, not credentials. To sum up: if I were you, I'd go to GT or UNC, build something impressive, save a lot of money, and then move to CA afterwards.
Sarah Householder
UNC Chapel Hill is a phenomenal school, and I doubt people will close doors to you because it's not Berkeley. You'll get interviews at FB/Google/Uber/Airbnb fine. IMO - I'd consider other factors, like location and culture. Choose a school you're going to enjoy. Don't choose one just for the name. All 3 names are well respected in the field. Berkeley has a huge advantage in the fact its located near the Bay, so if you're interested in founding a start-up, you might want to consider that. Other than Boston (MIT/Harvard), other communities aren't really as well developed.
Li Pi
I went to Texas A&M University, then got a Bachelor's and Master's in CS from Sam Houston State University. I worked at Amazon, and I work at Google now. It sounds like you want to get a job after college, and you're interested in being paid more if possible. From an economics perspective, you're going to have to make a lot more money to justify a $160k increase in college expenses. I assume you aren't fronting the $160k out-of-pocket or out of your parents' pockets, so it's going to cost you interest as well. Just to pick a random time interval: you would have to earn $16k more per year for 10 years just to break even on your college purchase. Do you think the reputation of UC Berkeley is $16k/year higher from an employer's perspective? I would bet you $160,000 that it's not. I think you would get more value out of reading a single book about salary negotiations than you would out of hoping a different college name on your resume results in a markedly different hiring experience. I know when you're picking colleges, it fills your horizon, and all you can think about is the prestige of a college, or how far away they are, or whatever rumors you've heard. But really, it's going to end up being a tiny part of your life. Incurring a large debt through student loans shifts the balance towards being more of a negative long-term thing. I have heard variations on this conversation many times: 1: Hey, so did you interview that one dude? 2: Yeah, he knew everything I asked him, and even suggested some improvements I hadn't thought of. 1: Oh, that's cool, I'm glad you finally got a good candidate. What college did he go to? 2: Oh I don't know, I just saw "Bachelor's in CS from <somewhere>" 1: Ok, let's extend him an offer. You will literally see your entire college career summed up in a checkbox of "has degree in <something>"
Blake Householder
I have a long-standing relationship with the UNC CS department and have sent quite a few very good students there. If you are serious and put in the work, you can do very well at UNC. What you want to do is avoid accruing a huge millstone of student loan debt. People today need to be smart about what they pay for college. If you are an in-state resident, UNC is a hard value to beat. What you don't want is to spend upwards of $250,000 for an undergraduate education. This will either empty your parents' resources for retirement or leave you with a "second mortgage" that you will drag around until you are 50. Do not fall for the trap that a "prestigious college" will guarantee you a job. If you want to put extra gilt on the edge of your credentials, get an MS or a Ph. D. Then, you are not the one shelling out. Most quality graduate programs will offer you financial support. The program at UNC is small; there are about 160 undergraduate majors. The faculty has 40-odd members so you can gain faculty attention. If you show intellectual curiosity and real drive, you will attract attention and will have great opportunities. Two of my recent graduates who went to UNC are now both Googling. You can do extremely well there.
John Morrison
As a intended computer science major at Berkeley right now, I know that a lot of silicon valley companies love the Berkeley name. Every internship position I applied for said they liked and favored students from Berkeley. However, in the software industry I think that your undergraduate school does not matter as much after your first job. They would rather hire a cs student from a less prestigious school who has contributed to countless open source projects rather than a Berkeley student who has done none. That being said, if you and your parents can afford Berkeley I strongly suggest coming here. Berkeley changed my life in so many ways. The amount of knowledge some kids here possess is amazing. Just from hanging out with my best friend everyday, I learned how to become a natural speaker. I used to be shy and stutter when talking to people, but he taught me something I had never been to taught in school. Now whenever I go do interviews, I can talk naturally and with passion. However, I'm sure Georgia Tech also has people like that. If you and your parents are financially struggling Georgia Tech would be the next optimal option. No one will discriminate you for choosing Georgia Tech over Berkeley. HOWEVER, the biggest benefit Berkeley has over Georgia Tech is its proximity to silion valley, sf, and even Berkeley startups. There are so many opportunities here for work and interns...it's crazy. tl;dr Berkeley if you can afford, Georgia Tech if not. Not sure about the other school.
Jisoo Han
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