Jehovah's Witnesses: Another question re: Abraham's seed?

Actually there are many places in the Bible so show that there is NO limit to the number of people who could go to heaven...the ONLY thing that stops them is that they fail to trust in Christ and Christ alone for full payment for their sin. The only way to justify only 144,000 is to twist the Word of God to make it say what we want it to such as Jesus being the ONLY mediator between man and GOD but the WT states the organization is the mediator for most In Revelations, we are told there is a great crowd which no man could number standing before the throne but to get out of this one, they have to take the simple meaning and make it complex to say that what is on earth is before the throne too. That would be like my saying because the White House represents the US, that when I am standing in my yard, I am standing before the White House. ANYONE can go to heaven just by: http://www.shatterdmen.com/first_step.htm

Jehovah’s Witnesses are wrong teaching that only 144,000 go to heaven, and much more. at Galatians 3:26-29 and Romans 9:6-8 where the apostle Paul makes clear that those who are rewarded with heaven due so in part as a consequence of God’s promise to the patriarch Abraham, and that the 144,000 heirs to the heavenly promise by virtue of faith are countless, without number, as numerous as the stars in the sky. 26 YOU are all, in fact, sons of God through YOUR faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For all of YOU who were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor freeman, there is neither male nor female; for YOU are all one [person] in union with Christ Jesus. 29 Moreover, if YOU belong to Christ, YOU are really Abraham’s seed, heirs with reference to a promise. (Galatians 3:26-29 NWT). Abraham’s seed - descendant heirs according to the promise - are also identified at Romans 9:6-8 where Paul makes clear that the heirs to the heavenly promise are not limited to fleshly Israel. 6 However, it is not as though the word of God had failed. For not all who [spring] from Israel are really “Israel.” 7 Neither because they are Abraham’s seed are they all children, but: “What will be called ‘your seed’ will be through Isaac.” 8 That is, the children in the flesh are not really the children of God, but the children by the promise are counted as the seed. (Rom. 9:6-8 NWT). Paul is referring to Genesis 15:5 where God promised Abraham that he would make his descendants like the stars of the sky, a promise that would eventually extend beyond fleshly Israel and encompass Christians. 5 He now brought him outside and said: “Look up, please, to the heavens and count the stars, if you are possibly able to count them.” And he went on to say to him: “So your seed will become.” (Gen. 15:5 NWT). This Abrahamic promise was reaffirmed and recounted by Abraham’s grandson Jacob while praying to God for deliverance from his brother Esau. “Unquestionably I shall deal well with you and will constitute your seed like the grains of sand of the sea which cannot be numbered for multitude.” (Gen. 32:12 NWT). Given these verses it is difficult to imagine how the heirs to the heavenly promise number a mere 144,000. They do not. They will be countless, vast; large in actual numbers yet small in proportion to the billions who have ever inhabited earth. Never-the-less, the Jehovah’s Witnesses counter that those countless heaven-bound individuals are countless because they could not be counted at that time. “God revealed the purpose and accomplishments of the Abrahamic covenant, saying that through Abraham the seed of promise would come; this seed would possess the gate of his enemies; Abraham’s seed through Isaac would number many, uncountable to man at that time.” (Insight, 522). Well, I suppose they are correct in the sense that the heirs to the promise could not be counted so many thousands of years ago because they had not yet been born, and therefore there was nobody to count, but that’s not what the Almighty meant. Regardless of the ultimate count it seems evident that the heirs to the promise will eventually dwarf a mere 144,000. Even the Israelites who numbered in the millions were referred to as beings as numerous as the stars (Deut. 1:10). in admonishing the scribes and Pharisees, Jesus said: ...you hypocrites. You lock the kingdom of heaven before human beings. You do not enter yourselves, nor do you allow entrance to those trying to enter.

Oh wow! Can't wait to read the responses!!!!!! :) Question? Why do JW's spiritualize the Scriptures that contradict their beliefs? Why do you guys do this?

"And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered." That specifies the seed, not those blessed by the seed. The seed itself is innumerable. Unless you're reading a different Bible than I am.

144,000 are the sealed of Israel Revelation 7:1-8 Jesus in not counted in the 144,000

God’s promise, “I shall surely *multiply your seed* like the stars of the heavens and like the grains of sand that are on the seashore,” has a spiritual fulfillment. It means that *others, who “belong to Christ,” are added as part of Abraham’s seed*. (Ge 22:17; Mr 9:41; 1Co 15:23) God did not disclose the number but left it as indeterminate to man as is the number of the stars and the grains of sand. Not until about 96 C.E., in the Revelation to the apostle John, did He reveal that spiritual Israel, those “sealed” with God’s spirit, which is a token of their heavenly inheritance, numbers 144,000 persons.—Eph 1:13, 14; Re 7:4-8; 2Co 1:22; 5:5. "Death's Only Remedy" - What Is Meant by “Resurrection”? - Who Will Be Resurrected? > Resurrection to Life in Heaven---For Whom? > Who Will Be Resurrected to Life on Earth? http://watchtower.org/e/20060315/article_02.htm

you bring up some good answers. What I have always wondered about JW's is why they are so evangelistic. I mean...aren't they overfilling the ranks of the 144k? And as for "the real truth's" web link and claim that "anyone can be a Christian just by this" - well that's not biblically correct. There's nothing any of us can do to become saved. It is by grace through faith in Jesus. If God doesn't give you grace, then you are reprobate.

Those were referring to Abraham's fleshly seed, the Israelites. There were millions just by the time they fled Egypt under Moses' leadership. The Scriptures do indeed show that the firstfruits (saints) are limited in number to 144,000 and THEY (saints) are the spiritual 12 tribes. James 1 KJV 1James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting. 2My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations; 18Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. Romans 8 KJV 16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. 23And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, Revelation 14 KJV 3And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. 4These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. Only 144,000 are adopted as the spiritual 12 tribes or firstfruits. The first ones saved, the ones partaking in the first resurrection which is to heaven. Revelation 20:4-6 and above. Debbie [email protected]

You go girl! Make them think!